New Rule Expands DNA Collection

[Alpha]

Guess soon they will be able to scientifically frame anyone they want to

From: washingtonpost.com

New Rule Expands DNA Collection to All People Arrested

Civil Rights Groups Assail Change


Immigration and civil liberties groups condemned a new U.S. government policy to collect DNA samples from all noncitizens detained by authorities and all people arrested for federal crimes.



The new Justice Departmentrule, published Wednesday and effective Jan. 9, dramatically expands afederal law enforcement database of genetic identifiers, which is nowlimited to storing information about convicted criminals and arresteesfrom 13 states.



Congress authorized the expansion in 2005, citing the power of DNA as a tool in crime solving and prevention.


The FBI created its National DNA Index System in 1994 to store profiles of people convicted of serious violent crimes, such as rape and murder,but the system has been expanded repeatedly, first to include all convicted felons, then misdemeanants and state arrestees. The data bank contained more than 6.2 million samples as of August, and officials estimate that 61,000 cases have been solved or assisted using DNA.



The change could add as many as 1.2 million people a year to the national database, U.S. officials said. Supporters equate DNA collection to taking fingerprints or photographs at the time of booking.


Artricle continues here

[Alpha]

Hmmm.....change eh??

US vastly expands its DNA databases


Sun Apr 19, 5:01 PM

WASHINGTON (AFP) - US federal and state law enforcement agencies are dramatically expanding their collection of DNA, including in their databases not only people convicted of crimes but also those simply arrested or detained, The New York Times reported.

The newspaper said the shift was raising concerns about the privacy of petty offenders and people who are presumed innocent.
Until now, the US government collected DNA samples from only convicts, the report said.


But starting this month, the Federal Bureau of Investigation will join 15 states that collect DNA samples from those awaiting trial as well as from detained immigrants.


The FBI, which already has a database of 6.7 million DNA profiles, expects to accelerate its growth rate from 80,000 new entries a year to 1.2 million by 2012 -- a 17-fold increase, the paper noted.
Because of this and similar efforts undertaken locally, US criminal justice experts worry that the nation is becoming a genetic surveillance society, The Times noted.


Minors are now required to provide DNA samples in 35 states upon conviction, and in some states upon arrest, the report said.


Sixteen states now take DNA from some who have been found guilty of misdemeanors.


"What we object to -- and what the Constitution prohibits -- is the indiscriminate taking of DNA for things like writing an insufficient funds check, shoplifting, drug convictions," The Times quoted Michael Risher, a lawyer for the American Civil Liberties Union, as saying.


Full Article

[DorieTesla'sMom]

Not everyone arrested is guilty of a crime- seems an invasion of privacy. I know what "they're" shooting for- to have a searchable database of everybody. Some of the Kool-aid crowd will say, "if you haven't done anything wrong, you won't have anything to worry about" Yikes!


This will probably end up at the Supreme Court.

[Alpha]

Not everyone arrested is guilty of a crime- seems an invasion of privacy. I know what "they're" shooting for- to have a searchable database of everybody. Some of the Kool-aid crowd will say, "if you haven't done anything wrong, you won't have anything to worry about" Yikes!


This will probably end up at the Supreme Court.

This is more than a violation of personal and civil rights IMHO, DTM....and yes, I am sure that's exactly what "they" are after!!!

We can't allow this!

[Dera]

A new "tool" for Big Brother? They already have my picture and my finger prints and my medical records and just about everything. This is just another damn thing to get us. Wait until they finish the census!

[Alpha]

A new "tool" for Big Brother? They already have my picture and my finger prints and my medical records and just about everything. This is just another damn thing to get us. Wait until they finish the census!

Dear Dera,

The pic you post is just the newest puppet on the stage.

I think we need to ask why there is no real and true difference with any administration, no matter what they purport to stand for and be.

IMVHO, they all are owned by the very few masters and do their bidding with a slightly different spin...and it seems they are very good at it.

I guess my question is this: Why do they have your pic?...and your fingerprints? For what? To enable you to get treated for medical purpose??

If so ,how did that ever happen? Who supported, lobbied for and legislated this?

What were your options if you refused?

This is mind boggling to me, sitting where I live....or at minimum it hasn't happened here...yet....

[Dera]

Dear Alpha,

They have my finger prints from every job I ever landed. The school districts, the US Army, the First Nat'l Bank of Pueblo, CO, and the Los Angeles County Sheriff's Dept. All of the above also have my photo in their files and/or on badges so that I could be admitted to their premises. The States of Calif., Texas, Colorado and Arizona all have my prints and photo so that I could have a driver lic. in their jurisdictions. I have a US passport. The Feds even know where my parents were living and where they were employed when I was born, not to mention much of my other personal information. The last "family doctor" that I had put all of my medical information into her computer while I sat and watched. She wrote my prescriptions on the computer as well.

All of this info. gathering has been going on for many years, including my school records having my young mug on them. It never seemed to be a threat until a certain political group got into power just recently.

You have no ID? Are you not identified in anyway at all in Canada? Passport, Driver Lic.? If not, wow! That must be really amazing freedom! You guys had better beef up your border controls 'cause a lot of us from the U.S. may be joining you!

As for Barack Hussein Obama, he has approved of a huge expenditure to put everyone's complete medical records in a vast computer system. He wants to regulate every tiny speck of our lives, from what we drive to what we eat, how warm or cool we keep our homes, etc. etc.

I believe the post that we are responding to says, "The newspaper said the shift was raising concerns about the privacy of petty offenders and people who are presumed innocent." Until now, the US government collected DNA samples from only convicts, the report said. As far as I know, this is new and more invasive since Obama and his cronies and the Democrat Congress got into power.
So, excuse me, please, but why should I worry about the government also having my DNA?

[Alpha]

OK...thanks for clarifying. I thought you were saying that your Dr also had your picture and your finger prints.

Yes, of course I have a passport, a drivers license, a passport. That said however never, ever have I ever had to submit my fingerprints for any job, for any ID ever.

I would be worried....very worried that the government, any government or any agency for that matter, would have either my fingerprints or my DNA.

People often don't use information with good intent and certainly could frame one beautifully with those personal and unique markers.

BTW, I don't support any huge database either with big brother knowing everything about one. In one way I'm sure the can aggregate most of it via credit card purchases, bank transactions....even RX's filled in one's name if they wanted to....this just makes it easier for them ...and yes I think you're right...the intent is to control every aspect of our lives.

They want to install smart meters here now for electricity where at peak times they can decide that you are using too much power and turn your air conditioner to a higher temp or off

[Dera]

Alpha, I guess you have never worked for any governmental entity or maybe things are done differently in Canada. I imagine there are lots of people in both our countries who have never had the "pleasure"! I never could seem to avoid it. I even had a US Gov't Secret Clearance when I worked for the Army in the early 60's. and let me tell you, they were excruciatingly thorough before the clearance was granted.

My first fingerprinting and health check (with x-ray) came in 1957, with my first full-time job after high school. (Yep, I had planned to "come out of the age closet" next month when on May 6 I will be 70!) Hells bells, I'm still trying to hang on to my optimism, but since Obama was elected as Pres. of the U.S., I have been scared practically to death for the first time in my 70 years so that I have had to really struggle to hang on to my optimism and I'm losing the battle.

Never, in all my years, have I been afraid of what the political powers might do to me and especially to the ones that I love. I am really afraid now.

I know that you don't like political side-taking, but this is a fact for me, and is probably the main reason I returned to IW....lonesome and scared. I am alone and needed some comforting companionship as I watch my world fall apart and to see if any others are of like mind.

As I said, watch your borders

[Alpha]

Alpha, I guess you have never worked for any governmental entity or maybe things are done differently in Canada. I imagine there are lots of people in both our countries who have never had the "pleasure"! I never could seem to avoid it. I even had a US Gov't Secret Clearance when I worked for the Army in the early 60's. and let me tell you, they were excruciatingly thorough before the clearance was granted.

My first fingerprinting and health check (with x-ray) came in 1957, with my first full-time job after high school. (Yep, I had planned to "come out of the age closet" next month when on May 6 I will be 70!) Hells bells, I'm still trying to hang on to my optimism, but since Obama was elected as Pres. of the U.S., I have been scared practically to death for the first time in my 70 years so that I have had to really struggle to hang on to my optimism and I'm losing the battle.

Never, in all my years, have I been afraid of what the political powers might do to me and especially to the ones that I love. I am really afraid now.

I know that you don't like political side-taking, but this is a fact for me, and is probably the main reason I returned to IW....lonesome and scared. I am alone and needed some comforting companionship as I watch my world fall apart and to see if any others are of like mind.

As I said, watch your borders

I think many of us here are alone and afraid Dera....I am so glad you're back here with us

I also think many if not most of us are feeling that the world as we once thought or knew it, or thought we did, is falling apart.

In these frightening and uncertain times, I find it very comforting to have a community where we can discuss what's on our mind, keep trying to find the truth, even if it's ugly, comfort one another when we can, learn from one another and have some fun at the same time.

You are right. I have never worked for the government and I can't comment on what types of positions in the Canadian government or in the private sector would require fingerprints, although I am sure there are many, specifically in the security and some government sectors.

Here at the Toronto International Airport, they have a new fast check through at immigration where one can sign up to have the iris of their eye scanned. Of course one must get this done prior...and this is just like having one's fingerprint in the government data base. I would never do this, even if it means standing in line for a long time at Canada Immigration and Customs.

Yeah, you know me and politics. I don't trust any of them and truly do think they are all part of the same bunch....just different sides of the same coin. However I know others feel differently and I respect that, or try to the best I can, although it's difficult for me to understand sometimes.

Let's just hang in there together while we still can.

[earthist]

Alpha, I guess you have never worked for any governmental entity or maybe things are done differently in Canada. I imagine there are lots of people in both our countries who have never had the "pleasure"! I never could seem to avoid it. I even had a US Gov't Secret Clearance when I worked for the Army in the early 60's. and let me tell you, they were excruciatingly thorough before the clearance was granted.

My first fingerprinting and health check (with x-ray) came in 1957, with my first full-time job after high school. (Yep, I had planned to "come out of the age closet" next month when on May 6 I will be 70!) Hells bells, I'm still trying to hang on to my optimism, but since Obama was elected as Pres. of the U.S., I have been scared practically to death for the first time in my 70 years so that I have had to really struggle to hang on to my optimism and I'm losing the battle.

Never, in all my years, have I been afraid of what the political powers might do to me and especially to the ones that I love. I am really afraid now.

I know that you don't like political side-taking, but this is a fact for me, and is probably the main reason I returned to IW....lonesome and scared. I am alone and needed some comforting companionship as I watch my world fall apart and to see if any others are of like mind.

As I said, watch your borders

Dera, your post touches my heart. I certainly relate to your fears and the difficulty to retain optimism. My fears started long ago rather than just recently, but I think they are similar, if not identical to yours.

I would hope since I have been living with my fears for awhile that I can offer some assurance that we can weather this, especially if we can avoid the urge to blame and hurt each other. FWIW, I offer sympathy and caring. You have me in years, but not by many (I'm 62). The Feds have my fingerprints, health records, and no doubt every word I've ever typed on the internet. I, too, was in the military once.

I don't expect to ever meet other than here in cyberspace, but it's good to know you here, even though we may vehemently disagree on some subjects. We really ARE all in this together, I think.

[Dera]

Dera, your post touches my heart. I certainly relate to your fears and the difficulty to retain optimism. My fears started long ago rather than just recently, but I think they are similar, if not identical to yours.

I would hope since I have been living with my fears for awhile that I can offer some assurance that we can weather this, especially if we can avoid the urge to blame and hurt each other. FWIW, I offer sympathy and caring. You have me in years, but not by many (I'm 62). The Feds have my fingerprints, health records, and no doubt every word I've ever typed on the internet. I, too, was in the military once.

I don't expect to ever meet other than here in cyberspace, but it's good to know you here, even though we may vehemently disagree on some subjects. We really ARE all in this together, I think.

Thank you, earthist. I appreciate your understanding and kind words and it is great that you are part of IW. And although many of us often disagree on many subjects and put a lot of emotion into expressing our points of view, I think that however it goes, we can usually kiss and hug at the end of the day. It is nice to have a place like this and friends like the members are here when it has all been said. You and Alpha are correct, we are all in this together for sure.

[Judee]

Beautifully put earthist and Dera! I couldn't add another word to express my own thoughts any better!