I admit I am finding it odd that in our small community here we have 4 ex-Mormons. Is that percentage the average? Or are we drawn to things that are different from the general public?
Admittedly, I was raised in the church, so becoming a member wasn't a choice for me, but perhaps it became an ingrained part of my personality - to seek out answers to "the big picture" in ways that are unorthodox. I have often wondered how the church and it's strange world view affected me, and now I find it very interesting that 4 of us here have this in common.
I live smack dab in the middle of Mormon country and I'm well familiar with the prevailing hypocrisy.
We non-Mormons have a saying in these parts: 'Never go fishing with one Mormon, take at least two, 'cause if you only take one, he'll drink all your beer.'
"Bring me my Broadsword and clear understanding."
So, you're observation could be correct, Muse. There may be more that you know.
You know it's funny. I grew up in a Roman Catholic family. And I am confirmed in the church. But you know alot of the attaction that I used to find has long since faded. It's not that Ive lost faith, far from it, but so much has changed over the past few years that my comfert in being there has really lesson'd.
Now one of the hardest things about a catholic family is if you don't go to church, Everybody gets wind of it quickly. And then they will keep on you to go back or else you prolly won't go to heaven.
"I'll be back when I'm ready" I say. "Well you better hurry and be ready soon cause the end looks like it's comming" they say.
Ive heard mormons can be pretty harsh on anybody that leaves.
MA tsaoc ot tsaoc ot netsil
Good work, Muse. I did not know any of that. I left the Church in 81 or so. Just after marriage in the Washington DC temple. Even as a missionary, I began to think of the Church as a right-wing political organization who was 'pro-war' all the time. A lot of CIA and FBI types are Mormons. I told them that I "did not believe Jesus was a Republican" and left. Never looked back.
But it is interesting that they keep 'mainstreaming' the Church with it effective PR wing. You might also remember that blacks were not allowed to hold the priesthood. This began to cause a lot of trouble for the PR department so the 'prophet (profit?)' got a 'revelation' in the mid 70s to 'allow' the blacks into the priesthood.
Much that is odd about the Mormon church was its incorporation of the 'Old Testament' into its doctrine. You can learn a lot about Masonry and its connection to Zionism with understanding how all of this was working in American history. Very interesting. It is my opinion that the 'inside government' of the US is a sort of Masonic/Zionist secret front that is very similar to Mormonism. It is sort of a militant Old Testament global mind set.
This is a fascinating thread and I am learning so much...thank you all for sharing this.
I look forward to reading more.
My background was rather eclectic.
Like VO, I was born in to a family who were born in to "Lutheranism" yet church, organized religion, other than for "show" at Christmas or Easter, for the community, didn't' really exist.
I guess the wave of Christianity affected the Eastern European people differently as most of their original roots existing withing nature and more aligned with pagan tradition by folklore, song and celebration.
Although we celebrated the "Christian" Holidays it was with a much broader and all encompassing brush IMO, for which I am very grateful.
My parent allowed for all possibility and explanation for our origins, our path and our purpose...in that they were very liberal, yet in other ways not at all.
Very interesting thread.
Thanks to you all for you input and insight
Yes, I was raised Lutheran as my dad's family were all German. I joined the Mormons on my own when I was 18. I was attracted to their interesting view of the scriptures and some of there more esoteric teachings - like, for instance, everyone is involved in an evolution that will one day make them Gods. And also that we lived before we were born here on earth. I was attracted to ideas like that as I felt I had lived before. In fact, I have always felt - even as a little kid - that I was a very old man in a young kid's body.
The Mormon experience is very deep in my opinion. It is almost impossible to figure out. On one hand, there seems to be evidence that it is all a scam and a put-up job. A hoax. And yet, there is also some evidence that there is some sort of basis in truth to it. This has always puzzled me. It is almost like alien abduction - on the one hand, it seems impossible that someone could be taken from bed while their spouse just sleeps - right in the center of a big city. Yet these people seem sincere.
The early Mormon leaders often seemed very sincere and willing to die for their beliefs. This is hardly what you would expect if they were just lying or putting on a scam. There is no doubt in my mind that many of them experienced visitations from angels and ET beings of a higher realm. There is no doubt that I experienced very high spiritual realms and gifts also.
Yet there is this dark side. Well, the alien experience is also light and shadows. Good and bad. Part scam and part real. This is why I come to a site like this. It is very hard to figure it all out.
The Mormons also have the most spiritual, touching music you will ever hear. Again, hard to imagine this heavenly music coming from devils. The Mormons have their own music that will touch your soul. I've been to the Mormon Tabernacle and heard the Choir there live. I don't care what you believe, that experience will melt you to tears. It is like hearing something from some Heavenly realm. Haunting.
Yes, it is not white and black. Something else is going on here......
As a matter of fact, now that I think of it, the Mormon history reminds me of the Billy Meier UFO story. On the one hand, it seems like a hoax and there are plenty of people who can demonstrate with 'evidence' and 'disaffected people' that it is a hoax. Meier's own ex-wife says that it was all a scam. And yet, we have plenty of inexplicable photos and movies. We have the excellent investigation of the situation by the Elder brothers and written about in 'Light Years' - a great book that took in experts like Col. Stevens (who himself did jail time?????? WTF?). And then you have the seemingly absurd book by Meier himself - the Testimony of Jmmanuel - which is a complete remake of the Jesus material.
How do you make sense of all of this? This is what gets me. It seems like a great 'clue' of something....... It seems to me more like we are living in some sort of dreamscape where things are true and shady at the same time....
There is a good book called "Early Mormonism and the Magic World View" by Michael Quinn. It examines the origins of the religion by placing it in the context of 1800's America, where folk magic was common. It was commonplace for people to use seer stones, divining rods, and superstitious fok magic. This was the world of Joseph Smith, who was interested in all these things prior to founding the church. He was also a Mason.
These things seem odd to us now, in this time. But back then it wasn't AS shocking. Of course, the polygamist part of the early church, which has been rewritten and is not believed by current members, is what was really offensive to people at that time - not the folk magic/Masonic part.
The most interesting thing is that the author was a history professor at BYU and has access to the church archives where he did all his research. Once the book was published, he was excommunicated. He still professes his belief in this religion, but is no longer a member because of what he published.
That is interesting, Muse. A lot of interesting books have come out of the BYU faculty. I wonder how some of them keep their jobs.
You know, one thing I am interested in is how many General Authorities have been excommunicated. The last I heard of was Paul Dunn. All the missionaries I ever knew had lots of Paul Dunn tapes. And then I think there was some Mexican/American G.A. who was excommunicated because of his interest in La Raza or some sort of native-American political movement or something. Do you know of these and others???
Other than the hypocrisy I saw, I really have no beef with the Mormon church aside from it being an organized religion. For that matter that's my beef with all churches. For myself, my spiritual journey of discovery is personal. I had to find and walk my own path. No one can hold my hand and guide me where I need to go. I have to do it myself. And I think I made a profound discovery that most people would be shocked to the point of burning me at the stake for knowing. But that's another story.
Here's some wisdom I've found on my path; It does not matter if you are Muslim, Christian ( including Mormon), Jewish, Buddhist, Wiccan or ( insert name here), If you believe in the ONE Above All, You can and will find your own path. Every religion is right ... and wrong. YOU have to decide what parts are right and what parts are wrong. Just like me.
On your knees you look up, Decide you've had enough.
You get mad you get strong, Wipe your hands shake it off ... Then you stand. Rascal Flatts - Stand
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